| Author |
Message |
David J Bush (Twixter)
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 03, 2002 - 8:05 am: | |
When I downloaded and installed Zillions, in the directory that contains the Zillions.exe executable file, the following subdirectories were created:
IMAGES\ has the .bmp files for the games
Audio\ has the .wav files for the games
Rules\ has the .zrf files for the games
I have downloaded many game packages, and every one of them deviates from this structure. For example, if I download "NewGame," the files will extract as follows:
The .zrf files go to NewGame\
The .bmp files go to NewGame\Images\NewGame\
The .wav files go to NewGame\Audio\NewGame\
Why is that? What was wrong with the directory structure Jeff Mallett laid out?
What's the point of adding another directory level for NewGame\ inside the Images\ directory which is already a subdirectory of NewGame\ in the first place?
Not only that, but almost none of the README files tell the user where these files are supposed to be extracted to.
Apparently, you're expected to extract them to the Rules\ directory. That would mean you get this structure:
.zrf files go to Rules\NewGame\
.bmp files go to Rules\NewGame\Images\NewGame\
.wav files go to Rules\NewGame\Audio\NewGame\
Ah, excuse me?
.bmp files in a subdirectory of Rules\ ??
.wav files in a subdirectory of Rules\ ???
Wouldn't the following be more logical:
The main .zrf file, the one you always open to start the game (if there is one), goes in Rules\
Any other .zrf files would go in Rules\NewGame\
.bmp files go in IMAGES\NewGame\
.wav files go in Audio\NewGame\
So, for example, a rules file NewGame2.zrf, located in Rules\NewGame\ , might contain this reference to a game board image:
(image "..\..\IMAGES\NewGame\gameboard2.bmp")
See those double dots? Each instance takes you up one directory level.
Note that this reference is still RELATIVE TO THE ZRF FILE, NOT relative to the Zillions.exe file.
So what, if everyone else does it? So what, if the old way works? This works too, and makes a lot more sense. Why not do it?
Thanks for your attention. |
Ken Franklin (Kenz)
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 03, 2002 - 9:31 am: | |
Those identically named "Readme" files can get mixed up - that's why I always provide an extended filename.
I like having the current subdirectories - it's helpful to have the matching images and rules together when creating a new game. It also allows the complete game to stay together after installed.
One thing I've started doing is submenuing my rules directory. ie; Chess, Draughts, Mazes, Connect4, etc. Then MultiD, Round, Large, Smallboard, under chess. All of this is based wholly on personal preferences. The complete game packages then get sorted out as well. Which continues to be helpful when I want to find this image from that game!
Unfortunately, with 100's of games (some not from this site), some of the earlier games' references do not flow without be re-edited. |
David J Bush (Twixter)
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 03, 2002 - 10:00 am: | |
> Those identically named "Readme" files can get mixed up - that's why I always provide an extended filename.
If the purpose of a README file is to explain how to install, then why not use a comment window in the zip file instead? The latest version of WinZip, 8.1, allows you to create a popup comment window that appears when the zip file is opened. Look in the Action menu.
Of course, any README file that explains how to use the program, should be in a directory distinct from the other READMEs.
> I like having the current subdirectories - it's helpful to have the matching images and rules together when
> creating a new game. It also allows the complete game to stay together after installed.
If ease of use is so important, then why do all submissions have unnecessarily complicated path names? See my example with "NewGame." The .bmp files are contained in:
NewGame\Images\NewGame\
Why not just use
NewGame\Images\
for your file path? That Images\ is already a subdirectory of NewGame\ . No other game files are going there.
If you want to quickly find an image from some game, wouldn't it be easier to look in the main IMAGES\ directory, rather than Rules\ ?? The main IMAGES\ directory already has lots of images that came with the original Zillions package. I propose we use this structure, which all the original Zillions games follow:
IMAGES\Game1\ contains images for Game1
IMAGES\Game2\ contains images for Game2
...
As I understand it, you prefer this structure:
Rules\Game1\Images\Game1\ has images for Game1
Rules\Game2\Images\Game2\ has images for Game2
...
If you want to browse through your image files, you have to go up THREE directory levels, and then back down THREE levels, to look at the next batch of images. And if you want to look through any of the original Zillions images, you have to make your way over to the main IMAGES\ directory. My way, just go up one level and down one level (although there might be further subdivisions of the final directory, this would be true in either case). Which way seems easier to you?
Thanks,
David |
Jeff Mallett (Jeffm)
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 03, 2002 - 2:57 pm: | |
>Not only that, but almost none of the README
>files tell the user where these files are
>supposed to be extracted to.
The reason is that you can extract them anywhere you want to and it will work. I personally extract all the zips to:
C:\site\zillionsofgames.com\games
on my hard-disk, but who else would want to put them there? :-)
>Apparently, you're expected to extract them to
>the Rules\ directory. That would mean you get
>this structure:
I personally don't extract to the Rules directory. The new games seem like documents to me and don't like putting things like documents inside C:\Program Files\... which is where my programs (like Zillions) go. Also, if I later install a newer version of Zillions in a different directory, I don't want to have to figure out which ZRFs were original and move them.
>"..\..\IMAGES\NewGame\gameboard2.bmp")
Hmmm... this isn't very nice to people who run from a CD or shared volume. I personally think that not forcing the user to install to a particular place is the most flexible. |
Keith Carter (Keithc)
| | Posted on Thursday, July 04, 2002 - 3:56 am: | |
I had the same question about the differences between the Zillions file structure and that used by contributers. For a long time I manually recreated the Zillions structure everytime I added a user created game. When I had about 200 games added in and decided to delete some of them, I discovered that following the Zillions structure meant having to navigate to and delete the zrf file, the image files, and the audio files seperately instead of just deleting one folder. So now I do much as Jeff does.
I still wonder why user games use the structure newgame\images\newgame instead of newgame\images. |
David J Bush (Twixter)
| | Posted on Thursday, July 04, 2002 - 6:24 pm: | |
|>"..\..\IMAGES\NewGame\gameboard2.bmp")
|
| Hmmm... this isn't very nice to people who run from a CD or shared volume.
| I personally think that not forcing the user to install to a particular place
| is the most flexible.
What's not nice about it? The user is not forced to install to a particular directory. If the directory where everything extracts to, does not contain the subdirectories IMAGES\ Audio\ and Rules\ then those directories will be created, and the program will still work. All pathnames are relative to the ZRF file.
This is the directory structure you established, Jeff, with all the Zillions prepackaged games. If you don't want submissions to adhere to it, perhaps you should mention that fact in the language reference file, or on your website. Your website does say "Pathnames should be relative to the ZRF." That's what I do when I submit a game.
| I still wonder why user games use the structure newgame\images\newgame
| instead of newgame\images.
Actually, now I'm glad they do; it makes it easier to change the directory structure around to my preferred way. Zillions checks path names relative to the ZRF and also relative to the Zillions.exe file. My IMAGES\ directory is located in the same directory as Zillions.exe. So, I can just move the whole newgame\ directory of images into the IMAGES\ directory, and the pathname reference still usually works in the ZRF file without any editing.
David |
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